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[Discuss] Discuss Digest, Vol 58, Issue 10 on racism.



What political correctness is is some group or groups' effort to gain advantage over other groups and enforce thinking and acting a certain way if not by guilt then by coercion by means of ridicule and lawsuits. Just because you believe what someone says is wrong doesn't mean they don't have the right to think it and say it. 
Freedom people!
Martin Luther King Jr. advocated for equality, not speech policing nor affirmative action, and certainly not more labels on people.  Because that continues tensions and makes new ones. 

Political correctness and affirmative action are just tyranny and racism with nice sounding names and enforced to the benefit of anyone except crackers. 
Still racism. 
But apparently racism is ok if its practiced against the right group(s). 

Stu

Sent from my phone

> On Mar 15, 2016, at 12:50 PM, discuss-request at blu.org wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. Re: free email less intrusive than google (Peter Olson)
>   2. Re: free email less intrusive than google (Gordon Marx)
>   3. Re: free email less intrusive than google (Drew Van Zandt)
>   4. Re: free email less intrusive than google (Rich Pieri)
>   5. Re: free email less intrusive than google (Gordon Marx)
>   6. Re: free email less intrusive than google
>      (Edward Ned Harvey (blu))
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2016 12:16:25 -0400 (EDT)
> From: Peter Olson <peabo at peabo.com>
> To: John Abreau <abreauj at gmail.com>, IngeGNUe <ingegnue at riseup.net>,
>    "Edward Ned Harvey (blu)" <blu at nedharvey.com>
> Cc: discuss <discuss at blu.org>
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] free email less intrusive than google
> Message-ID:
>    <941149747.10851.1458058585108.JavaMail.vpopmail at atl4oxapp106.mgt.hosting.qts.netsol.com>
>    
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
>> On March 15, 2016 at 7:52 AM "Edward Ned Harvey (blu)" <blu at nedharvey.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Political correctness is synonymous with respect for other people.
>> 
>> Anytime someone says they're sick of being politically correct, it means they
>> want to be disrespectful of other people, without any backlash.
>> 
>> The white man in the room doesn't get to tell us what's racist and what's not
>> racist. If the majority of black people would feel that's a racist term, then
>> by definition, it is.
>> 
>> Cotton pickin isn't racist, just like the confederate flag isn't racist.
>> Meaning - they both are. Because the majority of African Americans feel they
>> are.
> 
> To give another example, I heard someone yesterday refer to the paddy wagon.
> She was in a belligerent mood, so I did not think to inform her.
> 
> Dictionary.com has an entry for paddy wagon which claims
> 
>    1. Informal. patrol wagon.
> 
>  1925-30; probably paddy policeman, special use of paddy
> 
> Much further down the page it says
> 
>  Slang definitions & phrases for paddy wagon
> 
>  [1930+; fr patrol wagon, perhaps influenced by the fact that many policemen
> were of Irish extraction, hence paddies]
> 
> The entry for paddy reveals
> 
>  Origin
>    familiar variant of Irish Padraig Patrick
>  Usage note
>    This term is used as a neutral nickname or term of address for an Irishman,
>    though it may be perceived as insulting.
> 
> Dictionaries are supposed to define the actual usage of a word, based on
> citations of its use.  But this can only do a limited depth into the origin.
> 
> Is the paddy wagon the truck where the drunken Irishmen are loaded, or is it the
> the truck operated by the Irish police in America?  I suspect the former, but I
> don't have any way to determine the truth.  I think the term must have
> originated in the police vernacular.
> 
> Dictionary.com continues:
> 
>  Paddy
>  noun (pl) -dies
>  1. (Brit, informal) a fit of temper
> 
> Hmmmm, further down:
> 
>  An Irish person or person of Irish extraction (1780+)
> 
> Now, guess what?  If you look at these definitions you'll find lots of arguments
> that this was inoffensive.  It might be true.  The compilers of the dictionary
> probably never got hauled off in a paddy wagon
> 
> Peter Olson
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2016 12:27:01 -0400
> From: Gordon Marx <gcmarx at gmail.com>
> To: Peter Olson <peabo at peabo.com>
> Cc: discuss <discuss at blu.org>
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] free email less intrusive than google
> Message-ID:
>    <CAFrp2J3G2RS9jt=moWY7kwgA1JaqyexhQs_5V1H7UcyTdpno9A at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> This is why trying to get to some sort of racist ground truth is a
> fool's errand.
> 
> If someone calls you out on it, just drop it from your vocabulary.
> This is basic human decency and costs literally nothing.
> 
> On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Peter Olson <peabo at peabo.com> wrote:
>>> On March 15, 2016 at 7:52 AM "Edward Ned Harvey (blu)" <blu at nedharvey.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Political correctness is synonymous with respect for other people.
>>> 
>>> Anytime someone says they're sick of being politically correct, it means they
>>> want to be disrespectful of other people, without any backlash.
>>> 
>>> The white man in the room doesn't get to tell us what's racist and what's not
>>> racist. If the majority of black people would feel that's a racist term, then
>>> by definition, it is.
>>> 
>>> Cotton pickin isn't racist, just like the confederate flag isn't racist.
>>> Meaning - they both are. Because the majority of African Americans feel they
>>> are.
>> 
>> To give another example, I heard someone yesterday refer to the paddy wagon.
>> She was in a belligerent mood, so I did not think to inform her.
>> 
>> Dictionary.com has an entry for paddy wagon which claims
>> 
>>    1. Informal. patrol wagon.
>> 
>>  1925-30; probably paddy policeman, special use of paddy
>> 
>> Much further down the page it says
>> 
>>  Slang definitions & phrases for paddy wagon
>> 
>>  [1930+; fr patrol wagon, perhaps influenced by the fact that many policemen
>> were of Irish extraction, hence paddies]
>> 
>> The entry for paddy reveals
>> 
>>  Origin
>>    familiar variant of Irish Padraig Patrick
>>  Usage note
>>    This term is used as a neutral nickname or term of address for an Irishman,
>>    though it may be perceived as insulting.
>> 
>> Dictionaries are supposed to define the actual usage of a word, based on
>> citations of its use.  But this can only do a limited depth into the origin.
>> 
>> Is the paddy wagon the truck where the drunken Irishmen are loaded, or is it the
>> the truck operated by the Irish police in America?  I suspect the former, but I
>> don't have any way to determine the truth.  I think the term must have
>> originated in the police vernacular.
>> 
>> Dictionary.com continues:
>> 
>>  Paddy
>>  noun (pl) -dies
>>  1. (Brit, informal) a fit of temper
>> 
>> Hmmmm, further down:
>> 
>>  An Irish person or person of Irish extraction (1780+)
>> 
>> Now, guess what?  If you look at these definitions you'll find lots of arguments
>> that this was inoffensive.  It might be true.  The compilers of the dictionary
>> probably never got hauled off in a paddy wagon
>> 
>> Peter Olson
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at blu.org
>> http://lists.blu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2016 12:32:26 -0400
> From: Drew Van Zandt <drew.vanzandt at gmail.com>
> To: Peter Olson <peabo at peabo.com>
> Cc: discuss <discuss at blu.org>
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] free email less intrusive than google
> Message-ID:
>    <CADdM39wsbvXqQ0yqGngECY01eA85do5m==BjhjCVojNCrQcC9A at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> My Linux system doesn't have any of these weird commands installed.
> 
> 
> 
> *Drew Van ZandtArtisan's Asylum Board of DirectorsFirefly Arts Collective
> Board of Directors*
> 
> On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 12:16 PM, Peter Olson <peabo at peabo.com> wrote:
> 
>>> On March 15, 2016 at 7:52 AM "Edward Ned Harvey (blu)" <
>> blu at nedharvey.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Political correctness is synonymous with respect for other people.
>>> 
>>> Anytime someone says they're sick of being politically correct, it means
>> they
>>> want to be disrespectful of other people, without any backlash.
>>> 
>>> The white man in the room doesn't get to tell us what's racist and
>> what's not
>>> racist. If the majority of black people would feel that's a racist term,
>> then
>>> by definition, it is.
>>> 
>>> Cotton pickin isn't racist, just like the confederate flag isn't racist.
>>> Meaning - they both are. Because the majority of African Americans feel
>> they
>>> are.
>> 
>> To give another example, I heard someone yesterday refer to the paddy
>> wagon.
>> She was in a belligerent mood, so I did not think to inform her.
>> 
>> Dictionary.com has an entry for paddy wagon which claims
>> 
>>    1. Informal. patrol wagon.
>> 
>>  1925-30; probably paddy policeman, special use of paddy
>> 
>> Much further down the page it says
>> 
>>  Slang definitions & phrases for paddy wagon
>> 
>>  [1930+; fr patrol wagon, perhaps influenced by the fact that many
>> policemen
>> were of Irish extraction, hence paddies]
>> 
>> The entry for paddy reveals
>> 
>>  Origin
>>    familiar variant of Irish Padraig Patrick
>>  Usage note
>>    This term is used as a neutral nickname or term of address for an
>> Irishman,
>>    though it may be perceived as insulting.
>> 
>> Dictionaries are supposed to define the actual usage of a word, based on
>> citations of its use.  But this can only do a limited depth into the
>> origin.
>> 
>> Is the paddy wagon the truck where the drunken Irishmen are loaded, or is
>> it the
>> the truck operated by the Irish police in America?  I suspect the former,
>> but I
>> don't have any way to determine the truth.  I think the term must have
>> originated in the police vernacular.
>> 
>> Dictionary.com continues:
>> 
>>  Paddy
>>  noun (pl) -dies
>>  1. (Brit, informal) a fit of temper
>> 
>> Hmmmm, further down:
>> 
>>  An Irish person or person of Irish extraction (1780+)
>> 
>> Now, guess what?  If you look at these definitions you'll find lots of
>> arguments
>> that this was inoffensive.  It might be true.  The compilers of the
>> dictionary
>> probably never got hauled off in a paddy wagon
>> 
>> Peter Olson
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at blu.org
>> http://lists.blu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2016 12:38:47 -0400
> From: Rich Pieri <richard.pieri at gmail.com>
> To: L-blu <discuss at blu.org>
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] free email less intrusive than google
> Message-ID: <56E83A97.8060501 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
> 
>> On 3/15/2016 11:58 AM, Gordon Marx wrote:
>> Politically incorrect speech is not being suppressed.
> 
> Political correctness means you can't show "Blazing Saddles" in public
> because it might offend someone. Never mind that Richard Pryor, who
> co-wrote the script, insisted that the townspeople refer to Sheriff Bart
> as "nigger".
> 
> Oh, wait. I'm not supposed say that, not even in that context because it
> might offend someone. I can only allude to it as "the N word".
> 
> And you say that politically incorrect speech isn't being suppressed?
> 
> -- 
> Rich P.
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2016 12:39:36 -0400
> From: Gordon Marx <gcmarx at gmail.com>
> To: Rich Pieri <richard.pieri at gmail.com>
> Cc: L-blu <discuss at blu.org>
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] free email less intrusive than google
> Message-ID:
>    <CAFrp2J2rhR=4W7Kr3fHfwrUEY1jOtZg5RKpboq5yiKUzegRt0Q at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> That's not what suppression means, Rich, and if you don't know it,
> you're doing a pretty good job of insulating yourself from the outside
> world.
> 
> Good day,
> Gordon
> 
>> On Tue, Mar 15, 2016 at 12:38 PM, Rich Pieri <richard.pieri at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 3/15/2016 11:58 AM, Gordon Marx wrote:
>>> Politically incorrect speech is not being suppressed.
>> 
>> Political correctness means you can't show "Blazing Saddles" in public
>> because it might offend someone. Never mind that Richard Pryor, who
>> co-wrote the script, insisted that the townspeople refer to Sheriff Bart
>> as "nigger".
>> 
>> Oh, wait. I'm not supposed say that, not even in that context because it
>> might offend someone. I can only allude to it as "the N word".
>> 
>> And you say that politically incorrect speech isn't being suppressed?
>> 
>> --
>> Rich P.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at blu.org
>> http://lists.blu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Tue, 15 Mar 2016 16:50:33 +0000
> From: "Edward Ned Harvey (blu)" <blu at nedharvey.com>
> To: Peter Olson <peabo at peabo.com>, John Abreau <abreauj at gmail.com>,
>    IngeGNUe <ingegnue at riseup.net>
> Cc: discuss <discuss at blu.org>
> Subject: Re: [Discuss] free email less intrusive than google
> Message-ID:
>    <BY2PR04MB1842FB3D602C31E4F4B6373FDC890 at BY2PR04MB1842.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
>    
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> If you use the term "cotton pickin" in the presence of African Americans, you'll probably make them feel disrespected. Nothing more need be said.
> 
> But I'm sure not stopping anybody here from digging a deeper hole.
> 
> (Rich, I am not oppressing you. If Person A says something that oppresses Person B, who perhaps doesn't feel like engaging the conflict because this is something they encounter all the time, and then Person C says to Person A, "you're being oppressive," it doesn't then make Person C the oppressor.)
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Subject: Digest Footer
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss at blu.org
> http://lists.blu.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> End of Discuss Digest, Vol 58, Issue 10
> ***************************************



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