Linux, what are our objectives?

[tbs-Gb/NUjX2UK8 at public.gmane.org (ref)]

On Mon, 2008-11-17 at 09:18 -0500, markw-FJ05HQ0HCKaWd6l5hS35sQ at public.gmane.org wrote:
> > On Mon, Nov 17, 2008 at 8:37 AM,  <markw-FJ05HQ0HCKaWd6l5hS35sQ at public.gmane.org> wrote:
> >> So the question I have is this: is [K]ubuntu really the direction in
> >> which
> >> we as a community wish to see Linux go?
> >
> > KDE != Linux. Don't conflate the two.
> >
> > Sorry to be a bit abrupt, but this is a common mistake and starts a
> > bunch of conversations that don't really relate to Linux at all.
> 
> I'm sorry, but you missed the point of the post. Yes, I know KDE != Linux,
> and yes I know that [k]ubuntu != Linux. I've been using Linux since 1995.
> I got the memo.
> 
> The point I was making, and using the latest Kubuntu as an example, is the
> dumbing down of the GUI's on top of Linux (GNOME is equally guilty), where
> they are actually *removing* functionality. Even good old Linus dislikes
> this trend.

hmmmm that point was not obvious in your post. Having said that, I may
not know KDE but I do know Gnome, and I see no 'dumbing down' of Gnome.
In fact I see massive improvement. Anything can be added to the panel
(taskbar), Dolphin is an excellent improvement on Nautilus (file
manager), Compiz allows for innumerate stylings ... I can do more in
Gnome now and more quickly that I could when I first fell in love with
Gnome 1.3. Like you I have been using the linux desktop for a long time,
and while I have seen some features get removed, when the community of
users raised their voices, the functionality was put back (for example
in one of the gnome releases in the early '2 point something' days, the
'home' icon on the taskbar brought up the file manager without the file
browsing tree and without things like the file path address bar etc. The
community raised its voice, and lo and behold, the features came back.

Sometimes I can see where things appear to be a 'dumbing down' of an
interface, but I wonder if that is actually ever the case... I think
sometimes it really comes down to the frequency with which a feature is
used. If no one uses a feature, it may be dropped/obsoleted, or not
taken into account during major design upgrades. That is a normal
evolutionary path for any form of development, especially software. That
which is not used falls by the wayside.

One KDE question .. is it possible to put the icons back on the desktop
that they removed ?

> 
> Just a side note: having a snarky teen, I have learned that anyone can
> avoid a thoughtful discussion by merely being pedantic, by purposely or
> obliviously ignoring the intended point of a discussion and focusing only
> on some perceived (or manufactured) flaw in the premise or articulation.
> Then the discussion can quickly be side-tracked to a (sometimes heated)
> semantic argument that accomplishes nothing. For meaningful discussion to
> actually happen, the sides need to be polite and attempt to understand and
> evaluate what each are saying. Otherwise, it becomes clear that the
> intention is not communication but the obstruction of it.


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