[Discuss] Community out-reach... convert the masses?

[Randall Rose]

Thanks for the anecdotes and the other thoughts.  In the new group I'm in, Reboot, there are many Windows 10 and Windows 11 users who want to convert to Linux but would like friendly, non-intimidating assistance, and aren't likely to fulfill their longstanding desire to get off Windows unless they get that help.  

They come in many different levels of skill -- some like Dan's father may not have learned shell scripts, others are quite willing to do so or have already used them.  But they all want an environment with friendly mutual support.

Steve makes a number of points that he asks us to listen closely to, and I want to make clear that I have:
> Desktop Windows serves a purpose in the Linux ecosystem. It keeps the
> lazy, "I refuse to learn simple shellscripts" people off our mailing
> lists, so our computing lives don't get watered down. Linux is the
> place for people who want to boss their computers, not for people who
> want their computers to boss them.
> 
> Please listen closely to the following distinction: The preceding
> several paragraphs were about people who are proudly ignorant of
> editors, command line, config files and simple shellscripts. Windows
> users who want to have more control over their computing environment,
> and are eager to use editors, command line, config files and simple
> shellscripts, should be welcomed with open arms, and given an assist
> until they come up to our level of Linux use and knowledge.

I don't see a consensus in this discussion about whether we like this idea of keeping some off our mailing lists -- maybe that will end up being BLU's position, maybe not.  But what I would say is that even if BLU does take the position that Steve outlines, I still see a very valuable role that BLU can take in doing exactly what Steve suggests -- giving those who are admitted to the mailing list "an assist until they come up to our level of Linux use and knowledge."  I certainly wouldn't claim to have as much knowledge as many on this list, but I am eager to use the things Steve names in his criteria.  (There is also the question of, if BLU does decide to take Steve's position, how do we keep that from tacitly coming across in a way that actually discourages a lot of the people who Steve tells us to welcome with open arms, making them feel that BLU will never do much to help them come up to BLU's level of knowledge?)  I really value the experience and knowledge that is present in BLU.

On Tue, Feb 18, 2025, at 10:37 AM, Dan Ritter wrote:
> markw at mohawksoft.com wrote: 
>> 
>> I've been down this road before and it is difficult. Linux is not a drop
>> in replacement for Windows. Just as Windows is not a drop in replacement
>> for Mac. These are different systems with many similarities but quite a
>> few differences. For someone to adopt Linux, we would need to know what,
>> if any, deal breakers they have. You know, those cottage pieces of
>> software that they don't want to change or give up.
>> 
>> I guess the question is this: Can we help non-nerds be Linux users? As a
>> "user's group" shouldn't we help generate new users? Historically
>> speaking, I don't think there has ever been more user friendly linux
>> distros and better interoperability and usability.
>> 
>> Can anyone imagine a Windows 10 user actually converting to Linux?
>
> Here are the stories -- anecdata -- of two people.
>
> The first is my father, who stopped using Windows in 2002 when
> he needed a new computer and I explained that I would be happy
> to support him using Linux, but I didn't have much current
> knowledge of Windows.
>
> I ordered a laptop for him from System76, came over to his
> house, and set it up. We went through all the things that he
> needed and wanted to do -- web browsing, listening to music,
> access to email, a spreadsheet program. He did things while I
> directed him and he wrote down a bunch of notes on a pad of
> paper.
>
> Every so often he had some questions, and about twice a year I
> would come over and run updates or solve some issue.
>
> Eventually he was quite comfortable, and every computer he's had
> in the last 23 years has run Linux. He avoids using sudo,
> doesn't know the root password, and in recent years I've built a
> Wireguard tunnel so I can ssh in remotely and help him out for
> anything short of a boot problem or a network failure.
>
> Let's call that a success for an ordinary user, modulated by the
> fact that he had his own sysadmin on call.
>
>
> Now, the second person is my mother. While generally less
> technically inclined than my father, she was perfectly willing
> to learn complex procedures if they served her purposes. She was
> active on mailing lists, newsgroups and, completely without my
> intervention or knowledge for several years, IRC. 
>
> But she didn't want to change anything she didn't have to
> change, so whenever I proposed Linux for her next machine --
> "Dad loves it" -- she wasn't interested. I did get to install
> adblockers, though, and that helped a lot.
>
> I'm not sure if this really helps illuminate the potential
> audience for Linux adoption, but I thought it would be helpful
> to think of it as a process which individuals will judge by
> their own criteria.
>
> -dsr-
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