[Vhfcn-l] Training Versus experience

[William Confer]

As best as I recollect the 228th had a hook company at Cu Chi, the Muleskinners. One night in Jan or Feb 69, I believe  the NVA broke thru the fence on the NE corner of Cu Chi and they came right thru the Muleskinners area all the way to the West end of the Camp almost. They thru satchel charges in all but maybe one or two of the aircraft (CH-47’s). At least one crew chief was sleeping on his aircraft at that time and died in the aircraft. It was a bad day for Cu Chi residents. Other soldiers died on the perimeter, sleeping on duty, so I was told.  Bill
> On Jan 1, 2019, at 4:01 PM, Arnold B Christensen <abc15 at mindspring.com> wrote:
> 
> Bill, I never lost any Hooks I crewed including all of 71 when myself and my Tech Inspector acted as Crewmembers with full flight pay on 3 hooks a month output for Air Vietnam. Of course we did not miss dinner since we were all living downtown Saigon in BEQ's. Only time we came a bit close was out in the Crows Foot at that Army Base when we came in with 150 rounds of 105 ammo laid out on the floor from ramp hinge to the front stacked 3 high with a 10,000 Cap chain laid out at the hinge and two Cargo straps laid down across the whole mess.  Came in for a landing which you did in a nose high with only aft gear on the ground and got it stopped and would get the straps off and GIF's would raise the nose higher and we would pull the chain out behind all that stuff and they would roll down the ramp and onto the ground. I will admit that while we operated that time it did bother the Chit out of me when we did it.  This was before somebody figured out you could haul that same 150 rounds from point A to point B if people loaded them in Slingloads and we hauled them out and set them down where the Arty wanted them.  When discovered how good that worked they would make a piggy back load which was a sling load of the 105 How. and strapped to it was a "piggy back load" of ammo. As I remember the ammo load was about 80 rounds. Several of those rounds were often armed so that when we dropped them on "the guy with the vest on", they were immediately operational.  Before we got into sling loading almost everything that needed to be moved we got ready to drop off a internal load once again at the Crows Foot and as we came to a flare the #2 engine went into compressor stalls.  I don't know about what a Huey sounds like when it goes into compressor stalls but a Chinook engine sounds like a crazy infantry guy "galloping" a .50 Cal gun.  The 15th TC came out because it did not sound like a normal Compressor stall with all sorts of vibrations and banging back in the rear next to the #2 that we had never heard before.  Turned out the Sprag Clutch between the engine and the Engine Xsmn had failed and busted up and the engine ingested metal parts. Was a mess and was getting late and so decision was made to fly single engine back to our base camp in An Khe.  We did have a Hook flying wing position escorting us back. Replaced the engine and engine transmission and were ready to go the next morning.
> 
> I will say this about how many ships were lost... I never heard of Huey or any other type helicopter being lost to fire from cooking a meal.  We did loose many to being shot down or crew error.  On of the jobs us Hookers had was to go out and sling load it back home for repair there or eventually transport back to Corpus Christi, TX or Pensecola Navel Air Station to be fixed up and flown again.   I know that because in 73 I was the Chief Tech Insp at the 507 Trans Co (General Support) and had two Tech Inspectors at Corpus TDY to do final acceptance inspections on Hueys coming out of major fixing.  I myself made a couple of trips to Pensecola with the Quality Officer and one other CWO to do acceptance inspections on them before crews were called to come and pick them up. All of that was because of the condition of Hueys that we were receiving back in Ft Campbell. But to get back to the beginning or your note to me...We had on my ship up by the forward door 23 or more Huey silhouettes painted on the skin in just 7 months.  Other hook crews began to copy what we were doing. Someplace there is a record of Hueys, and 13's that were recovered by the 228th Assault Support Battalion which btw consisted of 3 Hook Companies of 16 aircraft each.
> 
> Chris the Bigfoot
> 
> 
> At 08:16 PM 12/31/2018, you wrote:
>> Well all I can say it’s no wonder we lost so many aircraft. I only destroyed one. Bill Confer
>> > On Dec 31, 2018, at 4:38 PM, Arnold B Christensen via Vhfcn-l <vhfcn-l at vhfcn.org> wrote:
>> >
>> > I get it Roger.  I assume that no Navy Helicopter ever allowed its crew to have small campfires on old chicken plates.  That was one of the differences between Hueys and Hooks.  Us hookers took the survival kit single burner stop out of the kit and sat down on the ramp and cooked up our C Rats.  Did not try to start a campfire in the chicken plates.   Pump up the single burner and turn it on and quickly went from a yellow flame to a hot blue flame.  It was the life being a Hooker.  We also could get a fresh cup of coffee out of our percolator plugged into the tracker power outlet.  110 AC Volts with 400 Cycles.  Do not plug your elect razor into that outlet because it would last just a second or two!
>> > Foot
>> >
>> > 11:31 AM 12/31/2018, Roger W. Ek via Vhfcn-l wrote:
>> >> > On Dec 31, 2018, at 11:00 AM, PAUL BIELECKI via Vhfcn-l <vhfcn-l at vhfcn.org> wrote: > > Pilots, unfortunately, have been losing many of the skills we had been taught or needed to acquire as pilots in Vietnam and other early Army Aviation points of station if we were to survive. I landed at Moc Hoa during the rainy season. The entire base was very flat and under 6 to 10 inches of water. They were about ready to leave for the worst of the rainy season. A flight of D and H-Models was beside the runway and troops were heating C-rats over open fires IN THE AIRCRAFT. They had small campfires in old chicken plates. At that moment I realized the fundamental difference between Army Aviation and Naval Aviation. Fast forward to 1992. We lost some helicopters in “the sandbox” because the lessons we learned about sand, hot weather, density altitude and tactics were forgotten in the interim quarter century from 1967 to 1992. Now it has been another quarter century from 1992 to the present. Even civilian light planes have glass cockpits and today’s civilian flight instructors do not tech flying in beta, incipient stall clues or skidded turn stalls (which can be violent). My Uncle Martin was a pilot in the Pacific in WWII. He took me for my first flight in 1946 in a Taylorcraft with a steel strap for the tail skid. He was a stick and rudder pilot and a life long flight instructor. ======================================================== ///,        ////               \  /,      /   >./    For those that have fought for it,                \  /,   _/  /.      Freedom has a flavor the protected                 \_  /_/   /. will never know.                  \__/_   <    /<<< \_\_         Roger W. Ek                 /,)^>>_._ \        Seawolf 25              VHPA 3377                 (/   \\ /\\\            Gentleman Flyer of the Delta                       // ````          China Post #1, AL, In Exile        VVAK            ====((`===== mequest at telplus.net    OWLS   Molon Labe ======================================================== Please Note: It is OK to print this e-mail. Paper is a recyclable, biodegradable, renewable, and sustainable product made from trees. Growing and harvesting trees provides jobs for millions of people, and working forests are good for the environment. Working forests provide clean air, clean water, wildlife habitat and carbon sequestration. _______________________________________________ Vhfcn-l mailing list Vhfcn-l at vhfcn.org This message was delivered to abc15 at mindspring.com http://lists.vhfcn.org/mailman/listinfo/vhfcn-l
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