I just *had* to comment.

[lug at the-leveys.us (Don Levey)]

 wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 02, 2004 at 05:07:09PM +0000, dsr at tao.merseine.nu wrote:
>>> As for why it's desirable, how many sysadmins do you think it takes
>>> to manage 1500 client machines and a couple dozen server machines
>>> 24/7/365?  The number might surprise you.
>>
>> Exclusive of help-desk activities and specialists like DBAs, that
>> could be handled by a team of 6 or so. You need 2 people during the
>> day, 2 more to handle two additional shifts, and 2 to cover
>> vacations/sick days/conferences. Another one is probably
>> advisable, so I'll say 7.
>
> HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!  That's really really really really funny.
>
> Just keeping windows up-to-date will probably be a full-time job for
> about a dozen people in such an environment.  Then on top of that, you
> should expect to have one admin for every 30-60 users, depending on
> the specifics of the environment.  Your comment suggests that you've
> never worked in a large environment before.
>
Well, I have.  Note that he said "exclusive of help-desk activities".
Keeping Windows up-to-date can be accomplished by a number of things,
including their auto-update feature, SMS, and even remote desktop.  And much
of that can be dealt with by the help desk.

> I have re-implemented, or been involved in environments that
> re-implemented something very similar to what Derek describes on more
> than one occasion.  And I never lived at MIT.  Doing so, in as much as
> is possible at your site, makes everything a lot nicer.
>
It may be - but there's only been one unnamed) example mentioned so far.
Considering the number of production environments out there, this does not
seem to move it beyond the "special case" category.  If you're mentioning
others, then that might change.

>> The number of client machines is not important to anything
>> except hardware replacement and initial install.
>
> That's quite preposterous.  You don't work in support at all, do
> you...

It depends upon 1) how you classify help-desk work, and 2) whether or not
you're categorising back-end and front-end work differently.  If you do,
then the number of clients is most relevant for load testing.
 -Don